Joshua Graves
Exploring the Collision of Culture & Faith
Mystic Speak
July 17, 2010

I distinctly remember living in a house in Antioch (East Nashville) during grad school. It was two or three o’clock in the morning. I woke up but could not move. I was completely paralyzed. The harder I tried, the worse it got. I tried moving my hands, they would not budge. I tried moving my legs, nothing. It felt like someone had placed invisible bags of cement upon every part of me except my face. Now, I understand that there’s a medical diagnosis for this: hypnopompic paralysis. Sleep experts tells us that the average person (I’ve never met an average person) will experience this paralysis at least once or twice in one’s life. What made this experience unusual for me is that during this temporary paralysis I heard a voice, not audibly, but a real voice saying, “Don’t doubt. Why do you doubt?”

There you are. This is as charismatic as I get.

I also should share with you the dream that Kara had several years back that spooked me. December of 2004—Kara and I had only been married a short time. We were living in Nashville but back in Michigan visiting our family for Christmas. During the middle of the night Kara awoke and told me she’d just had a dream about being in a strange land, in a building, with huge tidal waves coming over the building. She said she felt like it was so real it was actually happening. I listened, probably fell asleep I was listening so hard.

I rose early the next morning, a Sunday, to preach at a local church. On the way, I stopped at a convenience store to buy the local paper. Behind the counter was a television, set to CNN, covering the disastrous Tsunami that took the lives of hundreds of thousands of people. I’ve known Kara for almost ten years now. She’s had one dream the entire time I’ve known her about tidal waves and it happens to be the same time that the global village experienced loss and grief a hundred fold what we Americans experienced on September 11, 2001.

Some of you can relate. You’ve had dreams that feel more real than real life. You’ve had dreams that you were fighting in war and you woke up with a sore back from carrying such a heavy backpack. Or, you’ve had a dream in which a boyfriend or spouse betrayed in the worst way and your heart was still inside you though shattered into a million jagged pieces. Others of you can tell stories about recurring dreams that you’ve had since elementary school (1 out of 2 usually involves a clown but these are not dreams these are often nightmares). You know who you are. And there are more of you than most of you think.

Before you dismiss me , I would humbly remind you that dreams play a significant role in the lives of God’s servants in our holy scriptures. Dreams changed the life of the shadiest character in Genesis, Jacob. Dreams helped him to see himself for not only who he’d become but who God wanted him to be. Dreams got Joseph in trouble but they also gave Joseph an opportunity to move the cellar to the penthouse; from obscurity to the national stage (even if he was a bit arrogant about it). When God wanted communicate his most important message to a sorted, odd-couple regarding the entrance of the divine Jesus into the human plot, he did not send an official entourage, fax, memo, e-mail or Skype conference call. Nope, God sent a dream.

What I’m getting at is not necessarily dreams but what lies behind. What’s unseen is more real than what is seen? The spiritual world is just as vital to our experience of being human as the physical world that I can measure, memorize, and massage.

Acts contains an edict most of us would rather not listen to when Peter, quoting Joel, says your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams,” (Acts 2: 17).

Paul wrote, in the middle of one of his more well-known expositions on the power of love, “Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known,” (I Cor. 13:8-13).

The writer of Hebrews claims, “Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see. This is what the ancients were commended for,” (Hebrews 11:1-2).

Jesus himself, speaking about the work of the Spirit, once told a preacher that, “The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit,” (John 3:8).

Mystic Speak. It’s all over The Story.

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18 Comments

Josh… Let’s talk about this on Tuesday when I see you and Kara for dinner. Over the last few weeks I have had the craziest dreams of my life. I also have a lot of apocalyptic dreams I could share with you too.

by courtney strahan (Jul 17 2010, 9:50 pm)

They say we dream as many as 1200 mini-dreams a night. There are reams of information that have been written on the discerning of dreams and so on.

And now two pivotal dreams in my own life and ministry. And I’m not much of a dreamer to begin with or I don’t remember all the ones I have.

After moving to a new ministry, years ago, I had dreams of plunging toilets – perfectly good toilets. I remember resenting it in the dream. It seemed like a waste of time to plunge perfectly good toilets, but in every dream – eventually a bunch of you-know-what would come up as I continued to plunge. Somehow in the dream I knew this had to be done so that water could flow properly.

Within a week of having those repeated dreams, I was involved in having to address immorality among church leadership. The more I became involved in the situation the worse the carnage was and the more apparent that this was a generational sin in the church. Much of my first year was wading through this. It took vast amounts of my time, and had I not had those dreams, I’m sure I would have resented having to spend the kind of time that I did that first year, and in the subsequent years. I never spoke of the dream except to my wife and my elders. Having it, I suppose, kind of prepared my heart, internally, for the difficult season ahead.

A second dream happened years later during spiritually dry season in my ministry. I dreamed that I walked outside of our church building to my car in the parking lot. It was a beautiful, clear day. There was person standing at the front of my car. It looked in pristine condition. As for his specific description, I can’t remember, but I remember feeling that he meant no harm and wanted me to see something. He lifted up the hood of my car and motioned to me to look under it. My eyes fell on where the engine would be. But it wasn’t there. There was nothing under the hood. I looked at him, and laughingly said, “There’s no engine! What happened to my engine?!” He nodded and smiled, as though he was saying, “How about that?” Dream ended.

I awoke with a sense that my ministry and my walk with God looked a lot better on the outside than it really was. I had a “reputation” for being “alive,” but the fact is I had been missing my engine for a while. Long story short, the dream was the beginning of a new season of seeking God and of personal renewal in my life.

I’ve often wondered why there are dreams all over the Story, as you put it Josh. It could be the reason they are used on occasion is because the only time we are still enough to hear God is when we are asleep.

David spoke of our heart counseling us through the watches of the night.

And though, it’s one of Job’s friends and we must be careful about the conclusions we draw from their statements about God, I can’t help but think about Job 33:14-15 -

“But God speaks again and again though people do not recognize it. He speaks in dreams, in visions of the night when deep sleep falls on people as they lie in bed.”

Interesting stuff to think about….

by chris (Jul 17 2010, 10:47 pm)

josh, i was also living in antioch when you were in graduate school at lipscomb; and we shared a few classes together, though i’m not sure we ever shared a conversation.

all the same, i’m writing to thank you for being willing to speak about such things in the public forum of your blog. too often we’re not willing to talk about issues charismatic for fear of being ostracized or discounted. [or maybe i shouldn’t say “we” when what i really mean is me.

i’ve had several dreams that have corresponded with current events, i’ve woken up while (as best as i can tell) speaking in tongues, and other times i’ve been awakened with a burden to pray for someone in particular (and later found out there was actually a great need). i’ve received words during prayer that i was to share with other individuals — and they’ve proved in nearly ever situation to address a particular and current situation in that individual’s life. i’ve even received once the room number of someone from my work who had just been taken to the hospital and was in critical condition. i generally don’t talk about such things for fear of losing financial support while on the mission field — or upsetting more traditionally “closed” family members. thanks for being willing to be both open and honest.

by JamesBrett (Jul 17 2010, 10:59 pm)

I rarely remember a dream…don’t even remember having a dream….hmmm.

by Donna Lohr (Jul 18 2010, 3:43 pm)

Courtney–thanks, looking fwd to hearing about the dreams.

Chris–I told OC–this is as charismatic as I get :) Great follow up. Thanks.

James–thanks for sharing your perspective. I have such more more to say . . .

Donna–Watch out. This week, a dream is coming.

by Josh (Jul 18 2010, 8:15 pm)

One question for everyone. Is this considered a “risky conversation”?

by Josh (Jul 18 2010, 8:16 pm)

Perhaps it’s risky for us if we so limit God that he can no longer speak to us in any way other than those we are comfortable with (for many, that would largely be what he has already said in the Bible). I have not had such revelations myself, but I don’t doubt God can reveal himself in these and other ways if he so chooses. I would simply ask, to what end. Does God reveal things in dreams for no purpose? In the Bible, there was a message and an expected response with such revelations.

by Phillip (Jul 19 2010, 6:07 am)

Good question. Communal dream discernment. A new ministry! :)

I’ve had more emails from my sermon yesterday (mysticism was focus, not dreams) than any sermon in a long time. Interesting. JG

by Josh (Jul 19 2010, 6:49 am)

Josh,

Let’s say you have a dream, a hunch, a vision, or some other out-of-the-ordinary experience.

My questions for you: Do we always trust and attach significance to these experiences? If not, what criteria do we use to judge them? Should different people use different criteria?

Is this a risky subject? I don’t know, but I think it can be a fruitful conversation to have. I wish more pastors would discuss this type of thing with their church. Traditionally, I think you haven’t had to deal with this type of thing much in the Church of Christ.

I’ve seen sooooo many people hurt by trusting hunches and dreams that they thought were from God, but weren’t. I’ve even known someone who, after seeing a dream proven false, said that the Holy Spirit had lied to them.

I am going to listen to Sunday’s sermon.

Also: Ditto on the clown dreams. Personally, I hope there are no clowns in the new heavens/earth.

by rjohns (Jul 19 2010, 1:06 pm)

Hmmn…I don’t know about dreams. I’m still learning how to hear God speak when I’m awake. I know he does, there’s just too much other noise that I allow to drown out his voice…but I’m learning.

Grace and peace,

Rex

by K. Rex Butts (Jul 19 2010, 2:08 pm)

RJohns: I think it has to be tested for sure.
K. Rex: Good point.

Update: I had a friend say to me today, “I am just waiting for a guy to say he had a dream and God wants him to marry the girl no one else is interested in.”

by Josh (Jul 19 2010, 6:21 pm)

In regard to “communal dream discernment,” I actually think this is really the only way to go. In the same way that there’s communal discernment about a “prophetic” word such as what Paul speaks of in the latter part of I Corinthians 14 when he speaks of people “weighing” what’s said.

It’s no surprise that people can use dreams to endorse whatever it is their flesh wants. We do the same thing with Scripture, by the way. I think “communal discernment” is the only way forward when processing “religious experience” because we are so prone to seeking a “divine endorsement” of our will.
The community can help keep us honest.

I do think we need to spend some time within our heritage thinking out loud about these matters. It’s messy business, no doubt.

But in pretty much every move of God there’s a mixture of the carnal and the holy. We are “crack pots” (II Corinthians 4). I’ve often wondered if one of the many reasons Corinthians is in the canon is because of the local church’s struggle to process the things of the Spirit while it’s working out a cruciform life.

Josh, Luke Timothy Johnson has a great work on religious experience in the early church – in fact, that’s the title.

Thanks for the dialogue everyone

by chris (Jul 19 2010, 6:47 pm)

This can be a risky conversation for me in relation to my dreams that are about the Apocalypse. I don’t know about the whole being a prophet because that term can be thrown around in relation to such dreams. And I would like to just avoid that. I’m also hesitant to talk about dreams because I believe they reveal something about our psyche. It can be a way of being vulnerable.

by courtney strahan (Jul 19 2010, 8:02 pm)

Just a point of clarification on my end. In regard to the “prophetic” thing -I wasn’t referring to “prophecy” in terms of foretelling of future events or its relation to the Apocalypse.

I was using the term more like what Paul Paul may be working with in I Corinthians 14 – a “word” of encouragement, comfort, strengthening as he defines it in the context of I Corinthians 14. By the way, Paul said “you all can prophesy.” A sermon is a form of prophecy in that regard. And we “weigh” them every weekend. As well we should.

My point in regard to dreams is that they must be tested and weighed communally because we are so prone to “using” them for our own ends. I don’t think we can stress enough the need for the body around us to help process our experiences in life and with God. We see in part, know in part, and speak in part.

Not to mention the fact that some dreams are probably a result of the salsa we ate the night before.

Good conversation. This is more than I’ve ever commented on a blog in my life, but I couldn’t resist. This isn’t anywhere near the Gospel, but it’s good to kick around.

That’s tossing the ball on the court, Josh.

by chris (Jul 20 2010, 1:26 pm)

Well said, Chris.

by rjohns (Jul 20 2010, 2:00 pm)

by the way, I meant “thanks for tossing the ball on the court, Josh.” I don’t know what “that’s” refers to. :)

by chris (Jul 20 2010, 6:15 pm)

Chris, in these waters, you are my teacher. Thanks for writing.

by josh (Jul 21 2010, 8:22 am)

Tim McCay (sp?) asked if I timed this to coordinate with Inception? Ha. I’m not that organized.

Seriously, I have these planned 4-5 months out. Had no idea. Good question.

by josh (Jul 26 2010, 12:43 pm)
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